From: Andre Timmermann andre.timmermann@nine.ch
Am Mittwoch, den 08.10.2008, 03:55 -0700 schrieb Stanislav Sinyagin:
yes, Venty, everyone wants to know what you talk about in your private communications.
Yihaaa, the *****ng "I don't have anything to hide"-statement.
nope, it's the other thing: If I need to hide something, I use the right tools :)
so, if I go once and buy 1000 paper knives, I will not pay by my plastic card and won't use any Supercard or Cumulus :-)
Stanislav Sinyagin schrieb:
From: Andre Timmermann andre.timmermann@nine.ch
Am Mittwoch, den 08.10.2008, 03:55 -0700 schrieb Stanislav Sinyagin:
yes, Venty, everyone wants to know what you talk about in your private communications.
Yihaaa, the *****ng "I don't have anything to hide"-statement.
nope, it's the other thing: If I need to hide something, I use the right tools :)
so, if I go once and buy 1000 paper knives, I will not pay by my plastic card and won't use any Supercard or Cumulus :-)
Well, in the former GDR (DDR, East Germany), when they had elections, people could use the polling booth to mark the ballot paper in privacy. But most people choose not to - it looked too much as if they had something to hide and might want to vote with "No" (GDR was "famous for 99.9%" results.
What people don't seem to "get" is that privacy is something you've got to maintain while you don't really need it - because if you let it erode to the point that it no longer exists, it's too late and you can't reclaim it without large and painful sacrifices.
Rainer
You're right! Some (!) paranoia is not too bad.
Cheers Günti
-----Original Message----- From: swinog-bounces@lists.swinog.ch [mailto:swinog-bounces@lists.swinog.ch] On Behalf Of Rainer Duffner] IRC Server dead ?
<SNIP
Well, in the former GDR (DDR, East Germany), when they had elections, people could use the polling booth to mark the ballot paper in privacy. But most people choose not to - it looked too much as if they had something to hide and might want to vote with "No" (GDR was "famous for 99.9%" results.
What people don't seem to "get" is that privacy is something you've got to maintain while you don't really need it - because if you let it erode to the point that it no longer exists, it's too late and you can't reclaim it without large and painful sacrifices.
Rainer
_______________________________________________ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Rainer Duffner rainer@ultra-secure.de wrote:
Well, in the former GDR (DDR, East Germany), when they had elections, people could use the polling booth to mark the ballot paper in privacy. But most people choose not to - it looked too much as if they had something to hide and might want to vote with "No" (GDR was "famous for 99.9%" results.
That's a very good example. Do you have a reference to a quotable source on this? (German or English is fine.)
Greetings, Norbert
See:
Page 216 note 110
Dresden: Paradoxes of Memory in History By Elizabeth A. Ten Dyke Published by Routledge, 2001 ISBN 0415270367, 9780415270366
Regards, Michael
-----Original Message----- From: swinog-bounces@lists.swinog.ch [mailto:swinog-bounces@lists.swinog.ch] On Behalf Of Norbert Bollow Sent: 09 October 2008 09:53 To: swinog@swinog.ch Subject: Re: [swinog] IRC Server dead ?
Rainer Duffner rainer@ultra-secure.de wrote:
Well, in the former GDR (DDR, East Germany), when they had elections, people could use the polling booth to mark the ballot paper in
privacy.
But most people choose not to - it looked too much as if they had something to hide and might want to vote with "No" (GDR was "famous
for
99.9%" results.
That's a very good example. Do you have a reference to a quotable source on this? (German or English is fine.)
Greetings, Norbert
Salut, Stanislav,
On Wed, 8 Oct 2008 04:17:13 -0700 (PDT), Stanislav Sinyagin wrote:
nope, it's the other thing: If I need to hide something, I use the right tools :)
so, if I go once and buy 1000 paper knives, I will not pay by my plastic card and won't use any Supercard or Cumulus :-)
Thing is, you never know what you should have hidden last summer. Austria was once already this close to getting Haider into their government. Now imagine him as the minister of the Interior, sitting on all the data. And now it's not too unlikely to happen, again.
The laws of data protection define a necessity of "Datensparsamkeit". Under any possible condition, this is a code of practice which does not harm but it does help you a lot in some situations. The fact that people exercising this code of practice are already regraded as suspects should not prevent us from following it.
Tonnerre
SwiNOG is for Network Operator discussions and nothing else. The last few days have irritated me. Please keep such silly discussions off the email list.
Salut, Chris,
On Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:10:13 +0200, Chris Gravell wrote:
SwiNOG is for Network Operator discussions and nothing else. The last few days have irritated me. Please keep such silly discussions off the email list.
While I agree that Skype and Open vs. Closed source is off-topic (hi ylz), I think data protection is not really. But maybe that time is over too.
Tonnerre
at least it prooved the ML is still alive, and not so slow as some mentioned ;- )
we got 3 days nanog feeling, who cares ? if someone like an idling list.. we maybe could create idle@swinog.ch, and to make shure there is no accidentaly traffic setting this list to moderated this would be even helpfull for all the autoresponder fan's
Roger
Roger
Salut, Chris,
On Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:10:13 +0200, Chris Gravell wrote:
SwiNOG is for Network Operator discussions and nothing else. The last few days have irritated me. Please keep such silly discussions off the email list.
While I agree that Skype and Open vs. Closed source is off-topic (hi ylz), I think data protection is not really. But maybe that time is over too.
Tonnerre
Tonnerre Lombard wrote:
Salut, Chris,
On Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:10:13 +0200, Chris Gravell wrote:
SwiNOG is for Network Operator discussions and nothing else. The last few days have irritated me. Please keep such silly discussions off the email list.
While I agree that Skype and Open vs. Closed source is off-topic (hi ylz), I think data protection is not really. But maybe that time is over too.
I've to say that I really enjoyed reading all the posts... If I'm right I was the one igniting these "red hot flames" about open vs. closed source. I'm sorry for that :-)
though I'm the opinion that anyone of us need to think about data protection, security, etc... so the posts might be not that useless as it seems for some list members :)
I wish you all a nice and relaxed weekend
bests Marco
Tonnerre
swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
though I'm the opinion that anyone of us need to think about data protection, security, etc... so the posts might be not that useless as it seems for some list members :)
fully agreed, and every ISP could be hit once and getting blamed not to take care about dataprotection ...
Roger
I wish you all a nice and relaxed weekend
bests
-
Chris Gravell -
Marco Fretz -
Michael Krygier -
Norbert Bollow -
Rainer Duffner -
Robert.Guentensperger＠swisscom.com -
roger＠mgz.ch -
Stanislav Sinyagin -
Tonnerre Lombard